He has no way of staying equal in farm to any hard carry. He has no flash farming at all. He doesn't fall off due to being bad with gold, he falls off due to being unable to get gold.
He's an RNG-based hero, which means he's not reliable (crit and stun being random). Both his closing-gap ability and ult have horrible casting times. While he's a mobile and strong carry, he has to be ahead at every point of the game because if he falls back he has no way to recover, he's awful at farming and he has no flashfarming abilities at all.
On top of that he doesn't come online that fast, which is something important in 90% of the matches with the current patch.
well his stun is either high damage 2 sec, or lower damage but longer stun, it's not that unreliable, especially considering it's variing by 0.1 interval and not full seconde, so you almost get everything between 2.5 and 3.5.
If you are basing yourself on a 2 seconde stun, it's already a nice one, and the up to 2 more sec are just extra.
Crit is indeed too low % to be of a reliable use without ultimate (considering his as)
And as mentionned earlier, he suck at farming and cann't recover that's really the two lastest point that are problem.
Let's not forget 0 AOE, but I do hope a new meta change brings him back. I wouldn't say he's unfun, the random factor gives a jolt when you get a nice crit :)
Some random AoE on his stun would be good. Or add some chance to one shot creeps to his crit.
It's because he is too dependant on his ultimate. He doesn't need to flashfarm, because a 10k networth CK will actually be stronger than most 15k net worth carries anyway. But if doesn't have his ultimate he is just a shit hero.
It's awesome when you ult and use Manta and just suck some one in and insta kill them, that is always fun
I always thought it was cus of his mana issues. At level 16 wiki says he has 468 mana. Level 3 ult is 275 leaving enough for just one stun and reality rift. And the only int item that's good on him is drums.
I also agree with the farming. He's like sven with no cleave or wraith king with no vamp aura. Awful farmer. He really needs to secure some early kills to do well imo and is thus pretty dependent on his supports. He has a great early combo just at level 3 with a rift, stun and then pray for a crit. With any good nuker you should be able to score a kill.
@Sam "It's because he is too dependant on his ultimate." isnt void the same, actually? Of course void's ult is better but without it he is usually easily killable (unless he is way ahead of the enemy's farm)
Void is extremely fucking hard to actually kill. A hero shouldn't have 3 fucking spells that save his ass. Also Chrono's CD is only 80 and he still has two passives that gets better as the game goes later (unlike CK having only one).
If somehow Ice Frog buff rift damage to deal stat base damage(like morphling's adaptive strike) and give the bonus damage to his illisions as well than may be
Too many aoe heroes are popular at the moment as well. When you see tide, void, earthshaker, ember and sand king in most games you do not really want to pick a hero who hugs his own illusions.
his mana issues make most skip ultimate until level 10 too. Which is actually very crippling since it basically gives him 100% damage boost.
I think its the stun honestly. It's pretty much always going to be worse than a Sven stun, or WK stun, and unfairly so.
Reality rift is great, phantasm is great, his crit is solid. Having a stun on your carry is useful for sure but it needs to be rescaled. Make it cost 80 mana, then we're talking.
I liked his stun when it was completely random. Those 4 second, maximum damage stuns always put a smile on my face.
They need to reduce the mana cost for this ultimate drastically for him to see more play. I can't teamfight without his ult and even then he can only cast like 2 spells.
If you go late game though, he wrecks.
I agree that he needs either a better mana pool or maybe reduce the cost of his spells.
Do you think he might receive a buff in the future? If he did it would make him a really solid carry
80 mana, are you insane? sven and wraith king's as well as ck's int and int gain are all somewhat close to each other, and their stuns are all 140 mana. if anything ck needs his stun the least of the 3 because he has reality rift which is lower in mana cost and a higher cast range, and his movement speed is faster.
it'd be pretty cool if his phantasm cooldown for the lower levels was reduced, because even then people would level it up because having more illusions is worth the cooldown trade off, and he'd be able to use it more liberally in the early game.
Yeah but as a whole ck uses a lot more mana. His ult is 125/200/275 while sven's is 100/150/200. Wks ult is always 140. And sven's third skill costs a measly 25 mana, wk has two passives, while ck has a 70 mana spell he has to use to close distance otherwise he just gets kited. I think the mana cost on his stun is fine but his ult should be reduced by like 50 a level and possibly rift as well.
Small buffs will break the hero. Since in even games you can just throw armlet + heart illusions at the enemy base and will be a matter of time to lose. He is fine as he is imho
It is not about his mana problems. You can always find a way to compensate for that. The thing with him is his randomness. Look at Ogre. An extremely tanky support hero with late game buff for your carries and potential 1000 damage nuke. Sounds great right? No, because it's unreliable. In pro dota it's all about consistency.
Idk ogre fucking destroys pubs. 53% win rate vs ck's 46% and double the matches played. I don't think ogre's a good comparison and op is not asking why ck is or is not played in pro dota, he is asking why he's not popular in general. I really don't think it's the randomness. Pubs have trouble with farming which has been discussed and is quite valid and I feel they have problems managing mana too.
Mediocre illusion hero, but his presence in lane is somehow frightening.
Better mid hero than sven, i guess.
Less we forget ck wisp combo was actually quite popular.
Nothing wrong with the hero, doesnt need buffs.
A big patch will hit us sooner rather than later, it always does. If the meta changes in CK's favor we might see him more. Right now his lack of push, counterpush and flash-farm is really the main problem which could suddenly change if the games became longer, more gank oriented.
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He is one of the strongest carries in the game, why don't people play him?
Even Alch gets played more and he is a meh hero. is it to do with the meta?
He is a really fun hero to play as, with really good skills and that ult is epic. I don't get why no one plays him.