I even said in my first reply regarding PA to 귀여운 그릴 that:
"Not in a straight 1v1 fight though. PA with crit still hurts massively to any carry for that matter. Slark's dps isn't high enough for him to kill PA faster than a 6-slot locked PA can against him. >Auto-attacking one another<, PA would win via lifesteal + crit + mkb(assume Bfly Slark) + Abyssal."
Apparently, most people mistook it as "Slark can't beat PA". Which I never said any of the sort.
So slark isn't a hard carry but lifestealer is? See I was ok with differing definitions of hard carry until you threw naix in there cus he doesn't fit yours at all.
"Like I said...Slark isn't hard carry by the "norm". He is certainly powerful, but is not originally a hard carry. He's like Jugg, a very flexible Hero."
Jug item builds are flexible. Jug's role on team is not. Slarks role on team is becomming less flexible as well, he should almost always be the safe lane carry.
I think you are getting too caught up in semantics. You're saying a hero needs to be weak until they get 6 slotted and become beastly, that makes them a hard carry.
My definition is they are bad without items and they scale into late game. Applying some magical item number like 2-3 big items is stupid. Medusa can certainly carry games with 2-3 big items, most of my wins come after s&y, skadi, mkb/daedulus. Sometimes I get a fourth big item cus she farms so fast but game is usually decided by then. So by your definition medusa isn't even a hard carry.
Slark just comes online sooner, but he still gets stronger scaling into late game. PA on the other hand gets weaker cus of mkb counter.
Naix comes online with just one fucking item, give him armlet and he can go fuck people up. So how's he a hard carry? And he doesn't scale into late game that well at all compared to a slark or medusa or sven.
Jug is absolutely a hard carry, lowest bat in game = tons of dps later plus an ult that scales with right click and makes him immune. Just cus jug can fight with like s&y/manta and a drums doesn't mean he falls off later.
Slark fits hard carry definitions.
-Can he farm well? Yes, dark pact and leap make him a fast farmer if you choose to farm rather than fight
-Does he scale into late game? Yes
-Is he shit early with no items? Yes
-Can he put a team on his back at 50 mins and win game for you? Yes
That's pretty much the definition of a hard carry. Naix and PA both fail the fourth question.
And jugg has steroid of 1.635 damage if you count lower bat with crit . Pa has steroid of 1.525 with crit . Jugg has healing ward plus ultimate like wolf stated above . PA HAS DAGGER and blink strike with blink strike being neutralized by magic immune heros and blur being canceled by mkb's . I'd argue that jugg is stronger than Pa late game as well although I can see them being a lot closer than slark vs Pa .
3rd point is for actual game not some 1v1 shit, if you wanna battle 1v1 in the river, well, Abyssal, MKB, EoS, Rapier, Shard, Refresher on Slark. IDK what's PA gonna do versus dual Abysall and dual Shadow Dance?
PA can't carry teams that late, not unless someone else is locking down targets so she can burst them. Otherwise you just wait out her 5s bkb and blow her up, or don't even wait and blow her up with mkb carries.
That's why I said in direct auto combat. I didn't say anything about the standard way of playing Slark, which practically everyone does.
ok whatever actually there is no point in arguing when slark is the best hero (͡ ͡° ͜ つ ͡͡°)
I even said in my first reply regarding PA to 귀여운 그릴 that:
"Not in a straight 1v1 fight though. PA with crit still hurts massively to any carry for that matter. Slark's dps isn't high enough for him to kill PA faster than a 6-slot locked PA can against him. >Auto-attacking one another<, PA would win via lifesteal + crit + mkb(assume Bfly Slark) + Abyssal."
Apparently, most people mistook it as "Slark can't beat PA". Which I never said any of the sort.
And no m8. Injoker is best Heath Ledger. ( ͡° ͜ つ ͡͡°)
Slark had his way with you ^
"Hard Carries like Naix, AM, Medusa"
So slark isn't a hard carry but lifestealer is? See I was ok with differing definitions of hard carry until you threw naix in there cus he doesn't fit yours at all.
"Like I said...Slark isn't hard carry by the "norm". He is certainly powerful, but is not originally a hard carry. He's like Jugg, a very flexible Hero."
Jug item builds are flexible. Jug's role on team is not. Slarks role on team is becomming less flexible as well, he should almost always be the safe lane carry.
I think you are getting too caught up in semantics. You're saying a hero needs to be weak until they get 6 slotted and become beastly, that makes them a hard carry.
My definition is they are bad without items and they scale into late game. Applying some magical item number like 2-3 big items is stupid. Medusa can certainly carry games with 2-3 big items, most of my wins come after s&y, skadi, mkb/daedulus. Sometimes I get a fourth big item cus she farms so fast but game is usually decided by then. So by your definition medusa isn't even a hard carry.
Slark just comes online sooner, but he still gets stronger scaling into late game. PA on the other hand gets weaker cus of mkb counter.
Naix comes online with just one fucking item, give him armlet and he can go fuck people up. So how's he a hard carry? And he doesn't scale into late game that well at all compared to a slark or medusa or sven.
Jug is absolutely a hard carry, lowest bat in game = tons of dps later plus an ult that scales with right click and makes him immune. Just cus jug can fight with like s&y/manta and a drums doesn't mean he falls off later.
Slark fits hard carry definitions.
-Can he farm well? Yes, dark pact and leap make him a fast farmer if you choose to farm rather than fight
-Does he scale into late game? Yes
-Is he shit early with no items? Yes
-Can he put a team on his back at 50 mins and win game for you? Yes
That's pretty much the definition of a hard carry. Naix and PA both fail the fourth question.
PA can put a team on her back at 50 mins
No one said Pa can't carry just slark Carries harder late game if both have relatively same farm .
And jugg has steroid of 1.635 damage if you count lower bat with crit . Pa has steroid of 1.525 with crit . Jugg has healing ward plus ultimate like wolf stated above . PA HAS DAGGER and blink strike with blink strike being neutralized by magic immune heros and blur being canceled by mkb's . I'd argue that jugg is stronger than Pa late game as well although I can see them being a lot closer than slark vs Pa .
What the fuck are you people talking about?
1. Jugg is a hard carry
2. Slark is a hard carry
3. Slark > PA
3rd point is for actual game not some 1v1 shit, if you wanna battle 1v1 in the river, well, Abyssal, MKB, EoS, Rapier, Shard, Refresher on Slark. IDK what's PA gonna do versus dual Abysall and dual Shadow Dance?
Jugg is not a hard carry
PA can't carry teams that late, not unless someone else is locking down targets so she can burst them. Otherwise you just wait out her 5s bkb and blow her up, or don't even wait and blow her up with mkb carries.
Pa is not any harder of a carry than jugg . But ya neither one on the level of like a medusa or spectre
Too bad Jug actually is a hard carry.
Doubt, but ok