General Discussion

General Discussion@Shepherd of Fawns

@Shepherd of Fawns in General Discussion
Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

    I've been in that "forced" 50/50 recently after coming off a decently sized win streak.

    I play mainly pos 3.

    My mmrs got reset to the 3k range after the mmr patch change, and i am aiming to climb to mid 4k by end of the year.

    Can you give any advice on what i should do to win consistently specifically with my comfort heroes and heroes i played recently?

    Much appreciated!

    Тази тема била редактирана
    Lantern of Dreams

      Cool, dinner time now. Lemme have a look and I’ll get back to you :)

      Gym 5 days, Rest 2 days

        Your Magnus is most successful, followed by Mirana and then Terrorblade which you have a pretty high winrate low number of games played so that might be affecting it. Probably better to just stick to Magnus and Mirana.

        Lantern of Dreams

          Your overall winrate is not the best but recently you actually have a decent winrate. Definitely looks like you have some positives to work around.

          I am flying back home tomorrow and I’ll be reunited with my gaming PC so I might be able to look over a replay of yours too.

          In the meantime I’ll keep posting here some advice over time, I’m gonna have a think. Keep checking back ;)

          Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

            Okay man. I shall look out for that and save any follow-up questions for after you get back. Thanks!

            Lantern of Dreams

              Okay, I think I've figured it out :)

              I like to use stats to guide my thinking and how I plan to climb because fundamentally, in a zero sum game where on average each game is the same mmr up or down, focussing on winrate is a good strategy to climb. 50% is stagnating, 55% is a good baseline to climb, anything below is dropping mmr.

              So let's examine your stats:

              50.80% winrate lifetime is meh. For me I like to try for 11 out of 20 wins over a relatively short period of time and use that as a baseline for climbing.

              I think it's important to have at least 50% winrate on most played heroes. Or try to aim for that. It shows constant improvement. I would be a bit concerned that many of your most played heroes are sub 50%.

              In better news, your winrate for Ranked Season 3 is 52.95%, which is good enough to climb, but probably climbing slowly. With some work and some good planning, we can aim for 54%, which might not seem like a big jump, but I climbed from Ancient 7 to Immortal with 55.57% in solo queue.

              Some really good signs:

              Ranked matchmaking solo queue Season 3: 60.56% winrate from 71 games. That's great!

              But...

              Ranked matchmaking party queue Season 3: 49.35% winrate from 77 games. That's not good.

              So maybe you are thinking that you are stagnating because you are stacking with some weird stackmates. Not sure. Your solo queue % is excellent so let's focus on that and how to build you up.

              So the first lesson is, use stats and filters on dotabuff. They are your friend and it will give you information on how you are doing in your games especially relative to your skill level. Stats are the first way to analyse what are winning heroes and losing heroes for you (Remember 50% is even, less than 50% is lost mmr and anything above 50% is mmr gained). Once you have stats to give you a hint as to what is wrong, you can use replays to specifically identify what you can do better.

              Lantern of Dreams

                Okay so let's zoom into this month. Your ranked stats for this month are looking great: 62.96% from 81 matches. That's significant climbing, so in the short run at least you aren't stagnating. So really what we're looking at is how to push you onto Divine, because with some targeted work you can easily reach divine.

                Nobody gets to be high Ancient unless you've got a bunch of core skills that are going right for you. But at the same time, there's definitely some things holding you back from getting to Divine. So what we want to do is be able to identify what you can do better and create goals for you to work on.

                You play a lot of dota. I play a lot of dota too, but somehow you have hundreds more games this season than I have. That's a LOT of dota. Do you watch your replays? You should, because after stats it's basically the second place you should be getting feedback on how to improve. It is time investment but if you can fit 800+ games in a season, you have time to watch your replays.

                But before we dive into replays, let's look at one thing I noticed from your stats so I can model an improvement strategy.

                Your main role is offlane, and so the thing I'm looking at which jumps out at me is your most common items: and I'm seeing Blink Dagger at minute 21. That's super late to be your average timing. Now of course that may be because you don't have Truesight on all of your games but I'm also seeing that you favour getting a full vlads before blink, every single time.

                Also, I'm seeing that you generally favour the same sort of items on Mag: Upgraded boots, Vlads, Blink, BKB, Lotus Orb, Shiva's, or some kind of variant of that.

                Unless you decide to go for physical build and get stuff like Echo Saber, Crystalys/ Daedalus, Rapier with Blink BKB. You're very binary between those two builds.

                So the main thing about pubs is if you're the offlaner and you're a Magnus, you basically have two approaches you can take. Focussing on being farm efficient or being a tempo controller for your team. In general, tempo control is a hero that will go around ganking and controlling the flow of a game by suppressing the enemy team. You make space by taking away space from the enemy, allowing your carry and mid to farm. It's generally really important to have at least one tempo controller in your team.

                As an offlane main, eventually you will need to learn when to decide when to focus on efficiency and when to tempo control. However, for now I want you to practise being a good tempo controller and ignore farm efficiency. I know you have empower and you can focus on farming, but if you're a good playmaker then you'll be able to climb for quite some medals.

                That means for the next week of games (play unranked if you wanna practise), protect your blink timing. Ask yourself, "Do I really need the whole vlads or can I get just the morbid mask or basi and go straight for blink?" Or just go straight for blink. Tell your support your blink is coming up, tell them to buy a smoke, and make that blink reveal count. Go for a high value kill on the enemy mid or the enemy carry. Make that first gank like 80% gank rate and you'll watch your winrate rise.

                The reason I want you to do this is because early game is more important than mid game than lategame. Why? Because if you end early, you won’t have to win midgame, and if you end in midgame, you won’t have to win in lategame.

                Setting tempo is huge for increasing winrate and any 3 worth their salt should be a tempo expert.

                Also, lategame is where mistakes are most punishing so it’s best to practise making plays throughout a game rather than needing to land a lategame 5 man RP to carry.

                Този коментар е бил редактиран
                Lantern of Dreams

                  3 principles to play around then:

                  1. Play around your timings.

                  You have RP. Can you get a kill? Use it. First two or three uses just use it on anything. As the game gets later, start saving RP for more important fights.

                  Ping out your RP cooldown. Tell your teammates when it's available. Let your supports know it's coming up or unavailable. You are RP man. Be RP Man.

                  2. Protect your timings.

                  Are you not getting much in lane? Don't stay in lane. Stack jungle, clear jungle. Double stack your camps with right click+ shockwave. If you're jungling, buy clarities and use it to keep up efficiency. Try to make your blink timing early and don't compromise it.

                  Blink timing and item timings are one of those things that you need to play around. Ping out blink on your quickbuy. Are you using quickbuy? Use it. Protecting your gold and blink timings will be ez +100 mmr instantly.

                  3. Lead by example.

                  You are the playmaker. Be communicative. You are the man who will make fights happen. Initiate fights. Tell the supports and your mid you are making shit happen in 20 seconds at this location. Drag your team there if need be.

                  Don't be the guy farming jungle when team needs you to make space.

                  Have you got smokes in shop? Ask supports (nicely) to buy them and use them. Ping out RP, "Smoke here in 20 seconds, let's kill their mid". Have they got an invis hero? Ask supports (nicely) to buy them. If they aren't buying stuff, buy smoke and dust yourself. You're a playmaker. Be a leader.

                  So for this next week of dota, I want you to overcompensate and playmake the shit out of your games. I don't care if you should probably farm. Get really good at that, and try to get blink as early as you can without hurting your xp. Learn to make plays and make space like crazy and I think you'll start seeing good results.

                  Then we can draft the next part of your improvement plan.

                  Let me know if you have any follow up questions :)

                  Tomorrow: I’ll cover how to analyse your replays to start setting your own mini goals.

                  Този коментар е бил редактиран
                  Hayley

                    Wow u sure have lots of free time. Someone should reward u with badge or smth

                    Kæru

                      I am gonna offer that person an item on dota, this person is a gem for this forum

                      Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                        Great information. Now im gonna clarify a bit more.

                        I regularly ping out the status of my ultimate in my games, and try to direct my team to group up and smoke to a specific part of the map (by pinging or drawing a line on the minimap) in the last 10-15 sec of the cooldown. Teammates usually cooperate so far so i've no complaints there.

                        For me, the more complicated question to answer and execute correctly is when not to fight and take some other objective instead.

                        I use quickbuy. I buy detection if needed. I often make calls like going on specific targets, push this tower/lane, roshan, etc. These calls are all on my chat-wheel.

                        As for falling back to jungling, i sometimes dont do it fast enough as i can be stubborn and think that pulling the medium camp and/or cutting the wave a few times can help me keep up against the enemy duo or tri lane.

                        It's good feedback from the folks who replied here so far and I'll try to play some games this week and do more of the things mentioned.

                        Before that, analysing my recent replays, particularly the losses, would help pinpoint my mistakes or areas to improve :)

                        inx4c

                          "mimimi forced 50/50 mimimi..." ofc ure forced 50% winrate u donkey, dota is supposed to make every game 50% chance to win
                          everybody gets forced 50/50, only way to cheat it is to play better

                          Lantern of Dreams

                            Yes, that’s why he used inverted commas, to describe a stagnating winrate. And that’s why he asked for help, to get better and “cheat” the system.

                            Desephviasco

                              Glimmer plz give me advice on my thread tpo plz

                              Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                Inxac i dont have to use /s now do i.. I know i would get more than 50/50 if i played better. Lol.

                                Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                  Also, just want to add that (at least on magnus) i often play more of a 3.5 than 3.

                                  That has worked in most of my games so far except for the losses where the enemy cheesed with shit like naga, clinkz or my team (me included) just executed fights/ objectives poorer than the enemy team.

                                  I came away from those losses with the impression that if i could have farmed faster and/or made certain map movements sooner, i would have stopped the game's outcome from snowballing away from my team. I.e playing a pos 3.5 was sacrificing too much and my team needed me to actually have more core items.

                                  Lantern of Dreams

                                    Without a replay I can't make a direct assertion as to how you're playing your role. I have noticed that your item build is a bit static though. For example, Lotus Orb is a good item, but it's definitely far from an every game item. Same with BKB. I'm sure that there are plenty of games where BKB does nothing for you in terms of getting your spells off, in which case that's just a waste of gold.

                                    So let's talk about itemisation. Itemisation in dota is actually really tricky to get right.

                                    Back when I was a total noob (like less than a full year in) I met my first team stack and I still play with them today. The guy that helped me the most told me my Viper build was far too static. I had an obsession with SNY on Viper which was good in a lot of games but it wasn't the build for every game. (This was before Nethertoxin change and Atos Viper became a thing). Anyway, he made the point that I would be able to seriously increase my winrate if I was more flexible about my Viper builds.

                                    And now I am. Manta style, Pipe, Eul's, Drums, BKB, Guardian Greaves, Force Staff, Hurricane Pike, Shiva's Guard, Assault Cuirass, Lotus Orb, etc, etc, etc.

                                    The point is that you can easily push for higher mmrs if you just adjust your build for every game, because you are making your gold more efficient. It's basically making each gold worth more because you're putting them into the correct items rather than the standard build that you go for every game.

                                    severe

                                      you're doing fine
                                      keep playing mag/axe/mars

                                      Lantern of Dreams

                                        Hey man just giving it a bump to remind me to post replay advice.

                                        Kowareta

                                          ^
                                          hey
                                          i owe u a apologize
                                          u seems a very serious person
                                          so if my mongololoiod manners made u upset or any bad feelings
                                          im sry, i didnt mean that
                                          i want to say it in private but well didnt happened

                                          Lantern of Dreams

                                            That's okay man. I forgive you. Thanks for apologising.

                                            No hard feelings. As I've said before, you might think this strange but I actually like you. Sounds like you've got some frustrating things going on IRL- hope you figure those out. I know I have :)

                                            Kowareta

                                              i dont mind and care about being hated or liked on internet specially on this forum
                                              this is not me in real life not even 1% of me
                                              problem is, i dont count ppl in internet as real persons with feelings :))

                                              anyway, god helps your students.

                                              Lantern of Dreams

                                                Not caring is perfectly legit. It's your life man, as long as you're happy it's whatever. That and health.

                                                If you say it's not the real you, I'll take your word for it. But then again I've come to believe that most people reflect a true self onto the internet, because they have anonymity. Like that Rimuru guy, you can just see he's got a victim complex and I 100% believe he's got one in real life.

                                                But if someone is putting on a character for some reason, generally they have a good reason for it.

                                                And yes, definitely God help my students, the world's got some shit to deal with xD

                                                Kowareta

                                                  maybe its me, maybe not.
                                                  u are the person who decides, this is your world and you are the guy who is in charge, not me.
                                                  im perfectly fine with both scenarios :)

                                                  and i didnt understand Rimuru guy part at all. sry im not native english speaekr so i dont know what u mean when u say "victim complex"

                                                  Lantern of Dreams

                                                    Victim complex means he thinks everyone hates him and he blames everyone except for himself for his problems.

                                                    But as for yourself, I honestly don't have time to care. Too many things to do, and soon I'll barely be on here.

                                                    Kowareta

                                                      im not asking anything from u so i dont undesrntad what are u talking about

                                                      Lantern of Dreams

                                                        "u are the person who decides, this is your world and you are the guy who is in charge, not me. "

                                                        I was confused by what you meant here. My bad.

                                                        Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                        Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                          Lol. Nice to see Kowareta changing. Anyway i have been busy with work so not much time for new games until the weekend.

                                                          Lantern of Dreams

                                                            Ok then, how about this: play some games over the weekend, pick out 1 Win and 1 Loss and their matchids and I'll post some specific advice and ways to reason about your replays so you can learn from them. If you only won or only lost that's fine post 2 matchids then.

                                                            Make them recent so if I get back on Wednesday (latest possible) I'll be able to download the replays.

                                                            Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                              Here you go:

                                                              Win https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4990575539

                                                              Loss: https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4980749531

                                                              Besides whatever you pick out, I'd also like some specific feedback about improving my farming patterns and map movements. Thanks!

                                                              Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                              Putin get out of Crimea y...

                                                                Loss: "Match ended 2014-02-03"

                                                                Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                  Whoops thats not even my game. Edited.

                                                                  Gym 5 days, Rest 2 days

                                                                    Forced 50% winrate right here. Or more like forced 25% winrate.

                                                                    https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4990705489

                                                                    Tell me how and Antimage feeds 4 kills to a vengeful spirit bounty hunter lane within the first 10 minutes when he has a dazzle support.

                                                                    It is a long long time since I've had team mates this bad. WTF.

                                                                    Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                      Bloodsuka banned hahhahah. Imagine banning this hero in 2019.

                                                                      Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                                      Gym 5 days, Rest 2 days

                                                                        I wasn't even planning on playing him. I'm trying to learn clinkz but everytime I play holy fuck my team mates.

                                                                        It's like god himself comes down and fucks their brains up whenever I pick him.

                                                                        Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                          It's like god himself comes down and fucks their brains up whenever I pick him.

                                                                          Yes, that makes perfect sense.

                                                                          Gym 5 days, Rest 2 days

                                                                            Oh wait. I just checked their profiles. They're all from SEA queuing on Austrailan server. That makes sense.

                                                                            I forgot what it was like when I get SEA players in Austrailan server games. They are always always insta losses.

                                                                            Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                              Yes, since it's entirely their fault, there is absolutely no way you could have played any better than you did to overcome their superior ping and mechanical skill.

                                                                              Blue stars shall soon descend on this thread to back you up and report those SEA hordes for having the temerity to autoqueue all servers and wreck your precious online points.

                                                                              Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                                              Gym 5 days, Rest 2 days

                                                                                Oh i didn't see you were an SEA. Well at least you stick to your own server so thats good.

                                                                                Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                                  Oh i didn't see you were an SEA. Well at least you stick to your own server so thats good.

                                                                                  Yes, unlike the SEA mob you lose to, i actually like a challenge.

                                                                                  Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                                                  Gym 5 days, Rest 2 days

                                                                                    No I didn’t lose to an SEA mob - I had SEA players on my team. They fed so much with an anti age dazzle lane to an offlane bounty hunter he was level 14 and with more net worth than the guy who won mid about 15 minutes into the game to the point the bounty hunter was even able to solo kill a Clinkz. Reminds me of when I played low skill games and would get Pinot players, they would always feed, have no farm, and cause easy losses. You don’t really see them at higher skill games cause they never win enough to get into them which is why you only see them in lower skilled Aus pubs.

                                                                                    Lantern of Dreams

                                                                                      Bump- downloaded replays.

                                                                                      Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                                        Any insights / roasts?

                                                                                        Lantern of Dreams

                                                                                          Sorry was taking my sweet ass time about it :P

                                                                                          Also the loss you posted the dl didn't work so I went for 4997449503 instead.

                                                                                          Watching your tiny win, a few things jump out me just from the lane.

                                                                                          Look at CS. Drow is a really weak laner, and the Lina support kept dcing. In a 2v1 lane like that, a weak carry like Drow should either be harassed out of lane, die twice so she has no tp, and get very few CS. Instead, she's slightly behind you which is basically unacceptable for 2v1 and 1 being a weak laner.

                                                                                          A few reasons for this:

                                                                                          1. Magnus doesn't know how to play his lane role to solo zone the Drow and create an advantage for you.
                                                                                          2. If he solo zones, then you can get one or two levels ahead on tiny and be able to solo kill Drow if Drow walks too far up.
                                                                                          3. This allows you to sit on creep wave more effectively.
                                                                                          4. For some reason you didn't adapt and prioritise the lane so you can crush drow.

                                                                                          I know Tiny has great last hit damage, but if Drow should get nothing, just get the quelling blade. In fact, just get quelling blade in most games as a melee farming core. It has uses for pathfinding through trees, chasing kills and killing wards anyway.

                                                                                          Also, Drow's damage is entirely physical and your response was to get a phase boots. Since he has 0 armor and the lane is so physical, I would have considered getting ring of protection and quelling blade as my first gold expenditures because these are both available from side shop. Learning how to be efficient with your first gold in side shop allows your mid to have more advantages because typically the mid uses courier a lot in the first 10 mins of the game. You can always sell the ring of protection later if you don't think you want to use it in any higher tier items. Stout shield loses value quickly unless you upgrade it, probably replace it with a wind lace after blink.

                                                                                          Your use of quickbuy is good otherwise, I would just avoid tangos after minute 1 because salves give you more play options like salve in treeline. Any regen gap should just be covered by Shrine, clarity/mangos and Salve. Also, bottle is a very viable offlane choice if you are pressuring their lane.

                                                                                          Your movement on the map around your blink timing is pretty good. Ignoring the random dcs, you're making space and being active, which is good. What I'd like to see around 18:30 is you buying a smoke, telling Mag to come with you and another +1 and go gank with double blink and RP. You kinda just walk under where you pinged out vision, and there's so little point of your walking there. Just get a smoke going from your Mid T2 area or something.

                                                                                          In the end the fight still works out because they took a really bad fight of coming in one by one, but buying your own smoke and being proactive will make you better.

                                                                                          Lantern of Dreams

                                                                                            A few more points about that game:

                                                                                            1. When going high ground, try to toss enemies into your team rather than doing ava toss combo, easier to kill someone that way even though you do less damage.
                                                                                            2. You were the main tank role against Drow PA Lina etc, I would probably have gone blink echo saber into Blademail into Aghs. I know it's not meta, but Blademail is supreme value against these glass cannons and would make them scared of just dumping all their damage into you.
                                                                                            3. Think about Effective HP (EHP) when designing your builds. Yes Tiny comes with a lot of armor in his ult but he also has one of the highest hp pools in the game, making ring of protection, blademail, phase boots amongst other things really high value and you had slots spare.
                                                                                            4. Your camera control needs work. It's fine and perfectly okay, but you can get so much more information from the map with better camera control. I posted a short guide to LegendaryHD about it, but the main idea is, you spend too much time centred on your hero, and there's almost always a better position than hero centre.

                                                                                            Furthermore, when it is your downtime (e.g. jungle farming or going back home), use the minimap to look at all hotspots on the map, like all lanes and rosh pit because you can see spells being cast on the ground in rosh pit. Downtime is the perfect time to be information gathering and you aren't making the most of that time.

                                                                                            5. I never saw you stack a single camp and with tree grab that's basically heresy. You need to focus on efficiency when people aren't there to stop you, and stacking camps for any offlane with AOE is efficiency 101.

                                                                                            I think that's enough for now or else I'll overload you. I'll analyse the other replay after.

                                                                                            Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                                                            Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                                              Thanks for commenting. You make good points and i shall try to address my thought process behind each point. Im bring it up not necessarily to defend those of my sub-optimal actions but to further clarify and be corrected.

                                                                                              1. I underestimated my tankiness and laned too passively against drow. I only realised later on after a few min that zoning her out was the right action to take, but it was too late.

                                                                                              2. Regarding bottle on offlaners like magnus who want to stay in the lane as long as possible instead of going to check for river runes, my opinion is that it's relatively expensive for an item that delays the blink while only providing average additional regen. Also, i doubt bottle would be the right choice if my mid wants runes (like a storm). Also, perhaps it's my tier where enemy safe lane duos generally dont zone as much either, hence less need for that extra regen. Regardless, i shall try picking up bottle (and those other starting items you mentioned) in my next few games and see how that goes.

                                                                                              3. In that tiny game, I realised some time between 15-25 min (after the laning stage had ceased) that drow left the bottom lane to jungle and instead of staying near my team trying to position for ganks or to counter-initiate, it could have been more optimal to push that empty lane further. I did not do that because i thought at the time that my team could take a bad fight without me and snowball into a disadvantage.

                                                                                              4. I broadly agree on the blade mail, but there's the conundrum with how this item plays out in fights. It's true i was the only beefy (pseudo) front-liner on my team, and i want them to aim me. But if i get blademail, they might prioritise my teammates instead, so in my opinion getting blade mail in this situation conflicts with how i'd prefer fights play out (i initiate, they focus me, and my team cleans them out for an overall favourable trade).

                                                                                              5. Completely agree with the stacking. That has something to do with my map movements at specific timings of the game, which i was hoping you could provide more feedback about. Also, i went to jungle sometime during the mid-game and gave magnus the empty bot lane for a few minutes so he could get his blink and enable his next power spike. That action might have been more optimal for our team if i had stacked the jungle beforehand so i could farm faster, or perhaps i could instead have tried for 1 or 2 smoke ganks during that period of the game.

                                                                                              6. I think my camera control (when it isnt centred on my own hero) is more reactive than proactive. I usually click on other lanes only when they are being pushed out or when enemy shows to push or gank, to assess whether i can call for a team smoke gank, or if i should tp in to counter. Or if enemies show up in numbers somewhere on the map, to see which lane i can split push. My game sense is not at the level where i can consistently check enemy positioning and then call and execute a gank in advance of when the enemy team wants to group up and take an objective. You see that all the time in high mmr pubs & in tournaments.

                                                                                              7. At least for that tiny game, i thought i executed the fights largely on-point, either baiting the enemy team or timing my initiations properly to enable magnus to follow-up (since his initiation was harder than mine to execute). Prior to that game i hadn't played tiny for at least a year iirc, so my execution of the stun/toss combo was sometimes off. Something to practice for sure in lobby / future matches.

                                                                                              That's my two cents and i shall use this feedback in my next few games and see if there are tangible improvements.

                                                                                              Този коментар е бил редактиран
                                                                                              Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!
                                                                                                Този коментар е изтрит
                                                                                                Gaben, give me HERALD 0 now!

                                                                                                  Still looking for tips / feedback to improve!

                                                                                                  Jack Attack

                                                                                                    To keep it short for you. Try lycan. He is actually busted right now skip boots go 122114122. Hotd>necro 1>aghs>necro 3>bkb>ac>abyssal blade.

                                                                                                    LegendaryHD

                                                                                                      What tips you are looking for?